A Gulf War Refugee, The Power Of Community and Losing A Twin | Lloyed Lobo (father of 3, co-founder Boast.ai, best-selling author)

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Lloyed: We do positive affirmations and reward the process, the effort, the effort involved. Versus saying, oh, this is so great, or this sucks and you could have done better. This is great. You're trying, and that's what matters.

Adam: Welcome to Startup Dad, the podcast where we dive deep in the lives of dads who are also leaders in the world of startups and business. I'm your host, Adam Fishman. And in today's conversation, I sat down with Lloyed Lobo, who is the co-founder of fintech platform, Boast AI, and the startup community, Traction.

He is also a Wall Street Journal bestselling author, penning the book, From Grassroots to Greatness, where he shared his approach for building brands through community. He's a husband and the father of three kids. In our conversation today, we talked about Lloyed's background as a rebellious youth and his unconventional path to success.

We covered Lloyed's early years as a Gulf War refugee, losing one of his twins before birth, and his daughter's influence on his decision to prioritize family over work. We also talked about Lloyd's journey through depression and how he improved his mental health with a focus on family. Lloyd talked about some topics that he's never discussed before, and I'm so appreciative that he did.

Adam: I would like to welcome Lloyed Lobo to the Startup Dad podcast. Lloyed, it is a pleasure to have you on the show today. Thank you for joining me.

Lloyed: I'm stoked to be here. It's a topic that's dear to my heart, but I've never really had the opportunity to discuss this. So yeah, let's rock and roll, man.

Adam: Well, so I wanted to kick off and just ask you a little bit more about your background. You've had a pretty fascinating professional career. So tell me and our listeners a little bit about you and your background.

Lloyed: You know, I'm an accidental entrepreneur and now accidental Wall Street Journal bestselling author. Ooh, I'm holding the book wrong, right? From Grassroots to greatness, 13 rules to build iconic brands with community led growth. But accidental, I say, because I don't think anyone one thought that I'd be where I am today.

I was a pretty rebellious kid growing up. I didn't finish high school and almost everyone in my parents circle and my wife's circle wrote me off said like, he'll amount to nothing. Why are you marrying him? Or you've not raised your son properly. Those kinds of things. And you know, it's really funny.

One day during a very, very tough low point in my life. In my late twenties, my mom cried to me and asked, like, did I make a mistake giving up my career to stay at home and raise you? Did I make a mistake? Was that the wrong decision? Did I not give you the right values? And that was probably a massive turning point in my life.

And I think I started running since then. And I just never stopped running, startup after startup, failure after failure. And even after being a part of selling half of the company I co founded and cashing out, didn't still feel like a win. And, you know, writing this book and making it a Wall Street Journal bestseller was a gift to mom that, hey, You know what?

Money can be luck and other things, but writing a book and making it a Wall Street Journal bestseller is not and you know, for all the people that told you I would amount to nothing, they may not know me still, but they know Elon Musk and my book was on the same list as Elon Musk the week of the bestseller week.

Adam: I saw that!

Lloyed: So, that's a quick snapshot, but I was a very rebellious kid. Growing up, I don't know why number of probably, you know, nurture things, right? You become the average of the people you surround yourself with. All of my schoolmates were backbenchers, troublemakers. And I was the leader of the pack kind of thing.

And yeah, didn't finish high school. You know what's really funny though? So, despite not finishing high school, I still graduated engineering degree. Now, most kids who don't finish high school would never apply to university. I applied to every frickin university that existed, or that I had access to.

And one university followed up saying, hey, can you write these entrance exams? And I wrote the math and English, did well. And they asked me for my transcripts. I made up some BS story and they said, listen, we need your transcripts within a month. You can start the semester because you're running out of time.

But if you don't provide the transcripts, then you can't continue. Now, luck would have it. They never followed up. And I graduated in a bachelor's of engineering and software. And the lesson there is which summarizes my life and my journey. I completely believe in luck. I believe in the law of attraction.

I believe in manifestation. And the summary of my journey is luck and risk are two sides of the same coin. The ones that get lucky are the ones that never stop flipping. Risk, risk, risk, risk.

Adam: Yeah. That's an amazing way to live your life. Amazing philosophy. Tell me a little bit about, you had a pretty kind of tumultuous growing up life, right? If I recall, you're a refugee, Gulf War refugee. And so tell me what, you know, aside from everyone saying Lloyd's never going to amount to anything, what was life like growing up?

What was it like to be a Gulf War refugee? 

Lloyed: Honestly, life was great. I have never had a dull moment in my life. I think the saddest time, probably the only time in my life that I face planted and hit depression was when we sold a majority stake in Boast, in my company and I left the day to day of of the company and I felt I lost my tribe, but you know, here's the thing man all my life, I didn't have money or probably any privilege but I was happy, you know why I was happy is because I was surrounded by great people you know, the people slice that in all kinds of different ways, right? They say, oh, misery loves company, or you are the average of the five people you surround yourself with.

One statement summarizes my experience of the Gulf War. I think I was nine or ten and the war hit and the community came together to evacuate the country to safety. Security had lapsed. You weren't sure if you're going to live or die. No phones, no internet. Every building became a sub community that coordinated supplies and coordinated security and shelter and food and communicated with the next building and the next building that communicated with embassies and governments and helped us evacuate to safety.

And through that experience, as I was going on this rickety bus from Kuwait to Baghdad to Jordan on the highway of death. You can Google search highway of death in Kuwait and you'll see the situation there, burnt buses and whatnot. The adults, who didn't have a valid currency, lost their homes, weren't sure where they were going to land with their kids.

They should have been crying, right? They should have been stressed. But as I looked around the bus, as a 9 year old, I saw something very profound. Everyone was laughing and singing and playing the guitar. It was insanity. And it didn't probably strike me then, but when I was reflecting, during my darkest hours, after I left the company and got depressed, I realized that it's neither the destination or the journey.

Is the companions that matter the most. You could be on a crap journey on the way to hell and great companions will make it memorable. Luck, good fortune, whatever you call it. All my life I was surrounded by great companions where no hardship felt. Like it was misery, like I was going through something difficult, genuinely, like I don't even know how to explain this feeling because a lot of people ask me the same question, I'm like the Gulf War was great, I had a fantastic time, we were playing soccer, it felt like a camping trip, we were playing cricket, we were barbecuing, I almost burned a camp down, by the way, so, you know, every, every bus had color coded supplies, ration, and you know, as a nine year old, I was huge into Rambo.

Like Arnie, and Stallone were my favorites, right? And, till today, my morning routine song is Eye Of The Tiger. Big fan of Stallone. And I threw on a red bandana on my head and I was running around like I'm rescuing Kuwait from Saddam Hussein. And no adult there made me feel like this insignificant kid.

And, you know, reflecting back, I also realized another thing that great leaders, the cascade purpose, not just goals, the cascade purpose to a point where lowest common denominator like me feels like they're driving the damn bus, right? And so I accidentally pulled a canister thinking it's water from the other bus.

And when we landed at the first camp, my uncle, who's like super tall, lifts this massive canister to pour it in a vessel to make tea for everybody who are tired. Like that's, that's a thing that we drink in India and the Middle East. And it just exploded in flames because it was gasoline. And everyone was running, uh, camp almost caught fire.

But nobody made me feel like, you know what? Man, it's a mistake. You had the right intentions. And so, you know, all my life, I was surrounded by great people. Even before the Gulf War, my childhood summers were spent in the slums of Mumbai. My parents were working in Kuwait, that's why I was born in Kuwait.

But they were from India, and my mom grew up in the slums of Mumbai, where watching TV was communal, where eating was communal, where going to the bathroom was communal because there's no toilet in the house.

And every summer, it would rain a lot and puddles would turn into ponds and you'd be swimming in there.

It was a communal activity. I kid you not, man, at the end of the summer when we had to go back to Kuwait, I'd grab my parents by the feet and be like, just leave me here. I don't want to leave. I don't want to go back to Kuwait. I want to spend time here. And so to me, your companions matter the most the who you surround yourself with can put you in an elevated state of mind or make you feel like a peasant.

So no matter what the hardship was I've always been surrounded by community. Fast forward a few years, you know built after university I only ever worked for startups. My first job was working for a startup founder and my last job before starting Boast was working for a startup founder. And when we started Boast we built the company on the ethos of community because we didn't raise money. We had to get customers and we couldn't afford any other marketing tactics so we started hosting free events at our co working space because we had free space and that eventually exploded into traction which now we've had founders of Uber and Twilio and some of the biggest companies come to our conferences and events. But literally we built a company on community. Where I live in San Francisco bay area Is a community when my whole family was down and out with COVID, I was hospitalized.

They were sending us food every day. When we lost a twin, they were with us through and through praying for us, sending us good wishes, food, taking care of us. So all my life I'd been surrounded by a community. And, you know, it's just nothing has ever felt like a hardship. As far as I can remember.

There's only one time where I hit rock bottom is when I left the day to day of my company. And that's because I felt like, dude, I built my identity on this company. And this is my tribe, my community. I leave the day to day, I lose my tribe. And what brought me to good health and sanity was again, a community of fit, healthy, positive people.

And that's also the reason why I wrote the book.

Adam: Yeah. Well, we're going to get into that book here in a little bit, but I wanted to transition and talk a little bit about your family now. So you've got a partner, you have a bunch of kids. So tell me about life now. Tell me about your partner. Tell me about your kids.

Lloyed: Man, life is wonderful, knock on wood, right? Thank God. I'm thankful. I'm just thankful. I couldn't be in a happier, elevated state of mind. I got three kids, nine year old daughter, five year old daughter, who had a twin that passed, and she was born four and a half, five months premature, spent that time in the incubator, so miracle baby, and then a two year old boy.

And the last ten years, man, I spent no time with them. Just running, running, running, right? Like from that time in my late 20s, when my mom asked me that question, I was just running, running, running. And my wife would always tell me, stop to smell the roses, right? You spend no time with family. You're just obsessed with this one thing.

And I'd, you know, ignore it. And during the pandemic, we got into the due diligence of selling off the company, and it got worse. Nobody saw me during the pandemic. And my wife would say this is bad. I'm like, listen, I'm just going to book everyone to Bora Bora when this deal goes through. And she's like, nobody cares about your Bora Bora, the kids especially.

We care about like phones down, having dinner with you every day. Just the compound interest on that is huge. Nobody's going to remember the one, two week vacation a year. I'm like, yeah, whatever, whatever. The deal goes through, man. And I kid you not, two days before the Bora Bora trip, I got hospitalized for Omicron.

I'm on oxygen. And my wife, who's a physician at Stanford at the hospital, is not allowed to see me. There were people in space suits in 24 hour Zoom.

Adam: Whoa.

Lloyed: And that's when it hit me. I think, I think my, my life and everything, I struggled for flashed before my eyes. I'm like, if I die today, I haven't spent any time with the kids or my wife.

And the thing is, my wife and I have been dating since our teens. I was her prom date.

Adam: Wow.

Lloyed: So, we're best of friends. Everything I am. I have everything I am because of two women, very strong, my wife and my mom. And my mom. It's funny. You know, I'm not hyper religious, but my mom is.

And so before every sales deal before every major deal is big or small, I call mom and I'm like, pray for me. I'm worried. And so she tells me all the time I have equity in your company. She's a praying woman. God bless her. But life flashed before me and I'm like, dude, what good is this money?

Like literally what good is it if I die today? It's gone. It's literally gone. I don't experience it and then I have no relationship with my kids. The last 10 years are somewhat of a blur with my wife as well. And so how do I change? But you know, old habits die hard. I said I'd change, but then the company went from 30 people to 130 people in a span of six, seven months.

And I just got worse. You know, we brought in a growth equity firm. We brought in senior leaders from large companies, and I just couldn't figure out what my role is in the company. And I just got worse and worse. And my daughter comes to me one day, she was then seven and a half. She's nine right now.

And she said. Dad, you promised us you'd spend more time with us, but you've gotten worse. And I said, sweetie, the company has added a hundred people. I don't even know what my role is in the company. Things are just moving fast. We got to do right by the people who put their faith in us. So they are made whole.

She's like, why don't you go and work for somebody who thinks like you so I can have my dad back, right? Because we were all employee first. If you treat your people with love and help them grow, they'll treat your business with love, your business will grow. Everything was employee offsite once a year, even when we made no money, take them to Cabo, Costa Rica, Hawaii, bring people together through events, etc.

And man, I think I was at such loggerheads with the new execs that, you know, I stormed into a board meeting. After my third kid was born. This is a funny thing, right? I still didn't listen to my daughter and a few weeks after I'm at an offsite in Austin. I get 20 missed calls. My phone's always down like this.

20 missed calls. I pick it up. It's my wife's great friend and she's like, you're an asshole. You did it for the third time. I'm like, what happened? Like your wife's in labor. There's no sign of you're not even in San Francisco. I hear. Get on the next flight. Next flight is next morning because it's late and it's I barely make it to the birth of my third kid within like an hour and a half or so she delivers it. And then I storm into a board meeting saying like, Oh, these execs you hired suck. And like, I don't think they're going to work out. And they're like, whoa, whoa, whoa. You were like a single point of failure running product and GTM and all of this. And you've had a very stressful year from COVID to, you know, third kid and it's just, it's just been a tough time for you. Why don't you take a paternity leave for six months or so and we'll figure out the right role for you when you come back. And when you tell a founder who literally helped will this thing into existence, put his family on the line, kids on the line, that, you know, transition, like basically take a paternity leave.

Man, I faceplanted hard. I went home that day and I hugged my wife and I cried for 10 minutes. And I'm like, I'm really sorry for all the times you needed me and I put the company first. Today the company doesn't need me and you're the only person standing here. And that's when I hit depression. I felt like I lost everything.

Life was crazy. And then one day my wife yanks me and she's like, Lloyed, I let you grieve and I let you mope. And my, grieving was weird because I just started like blowing up money, trying to meet people I thought I'd never meet again, like fly from place to place, fly people from place to place. And I think I was in Romania at the conference speaker retreat.

Now, three and a half, four hours from Bucharest airport in the wilderness. And at two in the morning, I'm frantically dialing an Uber. And they're like, listen, no car is going to come at this hour. This is in the middle of nowhere. Where are you trying to go anyway? I left the Uber thing on. Finally, 20, 30 minutes later, cha ching.

And the Uber's on the way. When the Uber shows up, I'm like, hey, wait. I bring my bags. I put my laptop on the trunk. I book a flight to Costa Rica and I tell everyone, listen, I'm leaving, And the flight to Costa Rica was literally like four and a half hours away, so I barely make it to the airport.

Because I had some friends who called me and said, we're in Costa Rica, come. I felt like I was going to lose my whole tribe. That's how I face planted. And then when I get back from that trip, my wife's like, hey, listen, look at you. You're overweight, you're insufferable, but you're in a position that you can move anywhere.

When you choose to mope about something you don't have versus appreciate that the glass is half full. Everyone would want to be in your position. If something happens to you because of these lifestyle choices, you might not get a third chance. You got a second chance after COVID and that was that was a wake up call for me and I started to change things around and I think one of the biggest things, you know, when it comes to mental health.

Is we focus on a lot of exogenous factors, right? What are those to fix your mental health? Meditation, medication, and masturbation as a euphemism for all the other things you try to do to cope with it. But sometimes it's the environment, man. If the environment's holding you down, 9 out of 10 times if you change your environment, you will make a material shift towards changing your mental health.

And my environment was Silicon Valley. Entrepreneurs were just hustle, hustle, hustle. Oh, when's the next thing? When's the next thing? So it just happened to me. We started moving about and we had spent a month or so in Dubai. And Dubai is like Disneyland for adults. It's Miami meets Vegas, right?

Like it's the place where you don't do chores. Everything is done for you. It's a good mix of Miami, Vegas and Singapore with massive safety.

And so we ended up here and, and the beauty of this place is everyone's extremely fit. If you go to the gym here, for every person that's training, there's a trainer.

Like it's part of the culture. They actually have a fitness month where even the whole political party and the leadership just goes and out on the street running around and so on. It's a very fit place. And we decided to just move on the beach. Now if you move to an environment where everyone around you is fit, you become the average of those people.

There's two, three times you'll avoid doing it, but every time you step out of the house, you see a bunch of fit people walking the beach. You're like, okay, you know what? The third time, you're like, okay, let's see what it's all about. Fourth time, you're like, okay, let's do it. And the fifth time, it becomes part of your lifestyle.

Right? I think another big part is environment and two is working out. Being healthy is a huge part of fixing your mental health. And a lot of people just don't get the opportunity to work out. Think about it. All my life, I lived in the suburbs. Even going to the grocery store was like a 10-15 minute drive.

But now all of a sudden, I'm in walking purview, walking path of everything, to go anywhere I gotta walk and there's like 10 stores and the beach and everything, people are surfing and all this in the way. So then that becomes your lifestyle and compound interest in doing that over a year or so just puts you in an elevated state of mind, health, fitness, you know, it's funny, I put this Instagram post. I'll probably just quickly share so you can, you can, you can see, you can see how fat I was.

That was me 2021.

Now I do calisthenics, I can do the human flag. So, so you see that really changed my life around is changing the environment. Sometimes that's all it takes.

Adam: Yeah. Yeah. So I wanted to ask you, so your wife's a doctor. You're a, for a long time, an intense startup founder who lives for work. What was the decision like for the two of you to start a family with that kind of relationship? Intense lifestyle. Most people would say that doesn't make any sense.

Lloyed: Love makes you do stupid things. But you know what's funny? An inexperienced entrepreneur and an inexperienced see there's passion in both right relationships and business when passion meets profession you become Michael Jackson and and and what that means is like you you put your full force so what happens is you've never been married before you're dating since you're in freaking just finished high school you're like prom dates virtually right you're naive you're like I love you and all that matters like we're gonna make it work. Same thing with business.

I don't give a crap about what the naysayers are saying. I'm going full steam. I'm going. Sometimes it's better not to know of the pains in your path because you'll just run and you might get poked a few times but you'll just like move on versus you psyching yourself out about the hundred things that could go wrong.

Now on the personal side, you know, I'm a very intense founder, but on the personal side, I'm super nervous. My wife's a very intense partner. And so what that means is, she got into medical school second year of undergrad, so she knew her path was going to be long, long journey to being a doctor, and then she did a fellowship.

So she always wanted to have a family, and she's like, money is a means for me. Yes, I want to draw joy from what I'm doing, that's why I want to become a doctor. But that doesn't mean I'm going to go into a profession that puts me 24-7 on call, and I'm not going to optimize for additional hundreds of thousands of dollars.

I picked ER, and she's a professor, she teaches medicine, because I have a set number of shifts and when I leave, it's on the ER table, it's in the school, unlike others who have to bring it home. And I want to raise a family. Man, we had no money and we were paying expensive rent. And I was on unemployment when we started Boast. And she had the fortitude to buy a house. I was in Vancouver, Canada , at a meeting or a conference or something. And she's like, listen, I'm, I found this great suburb and the houses are really cheap relative to anywhere else in the Bay Area. And I put my name in the hat. It's a lottery system in the Bay Area for new homes and our name's up.

So let's go for it. I think we got that house for like 700 and change and now it's appreciated to significantly like more than 3x that amount. But that was, that was her thing because I am this person who just flies by the seat of my pants. Like in the sense like I have the passion, I know what the purpose and vision is and I'm just going to figure it out.

My wife on the other hand, from the time she was 15, she told me I'm going to be a doctor. And I'm going to live in the ‘burbs and I'm going to have three kids. That's exactly how, and I'm, that's precisely how it played out.

and I didn't even want, I was like, imagine this.

I'm on UI, starting a company. And she's talking about putting a down payment on a house. And make mortgage payments while she's a resident fellow, right? She, she doesn't even have a full doctor salary. She's being like $50,000 and I'm freaking out. I'm like, she's like, don't worry about it. Now, you know, I have very supportive parents who are great and my parents knew how much rent we were paying in the Bay Area.

So they're like, listen, we're just going to give you the down payment. And that decision that they did without including me haunted me for so long because I, I never wanted that, that I, you know, as soon as I had the opportunity to cash out from Boast, one of the first things I did was without, without telling me, they wired the down payment without telling them I wired them the money.

I'm very, very close with my parents, right? They spend the winters with us wherever we are, like, they're like extended parents to my kids, et cetera. But yeah, it was my wife's fortitude. The same thing with kids. She's like, listen, you know, I knew in business pain is the precondition for growth. Everything great is on the other side of pain and hardship and risk and uncertainty and consistency.

And she's like, you know, I'm doing the same thing in personal life. If she's like, we're going to get old. If you wait for when things are perfect, we might not be able to have kids. So why don't we have them and things will work out. I kid you not man. She even suggested we had a nanny and I'm like, are you kidding me a mortgage, now first kid you want a nanny?

I'm like, oh there's no money like what the hell and you know, I kid you not the best decision ever because quickly thereafter she ended up becoming a doctor the pay went up and she's like rather than investing in a week or two week three week vacation a year, why don't we just invest that money in a nanny?

And she's like, it's an investment. Look at it. You're working 24-7. I'm an ER doc. Our lives are crazy. What'll happen when we get home or any free time? We'll start, we'll jump at each other's throat. You're not doing enough. You're not doing enough. You're not doing the dishes. You're not taking after the kids.

If we have a nanny, we will not fight about these little things. And the compound interest on fighting every day about stupid things will lead to divorce, which no two week vacation is gonna save.

I kid you not, man, that was so true because now as I reflect back and, you know, living in Dubai, nanny and driver and all of these services are part of the culture.

It gives you so much free time in your day. Think about the American dream. I mean, it's great for the 1%, 2 % of the people that make it, but for the majority of people, and for me, for the longest time, all my friends, this is life. You wake up early, right, to pack kids. You can never afford to live where you work if you have a couple kids, especially if your work's in the city, so you gotta live in the burbs.

That means you have a long ass commute. And then, you're, you're going early, you come back, you gotta maybe bring your kids from school, make them dinner, everything, plan for the next day for your kids, and then you're catching up on email after dinner, and then you crash. A whole week is gone like this. You have just enough energy on the weekend to have one, maybe, social activity, then you're spending time dropping kids to and from activity. Sunday is gone planning for the following week. This goes by and goes by and goes by in parallel. You know what happens you pay federal tax state tax property tax and you lose more than half. And then maybe you can just afford to have one or two nice vacations a year. You go through life through 65 not having the freedom. Living from negotiables not non negotiables And at 65, now you retire and you're barely functional because you haven't spent the time on your personal well being.

And now you've gone from giving it to the tax system to now the hospital system. And this was a big awakening for me when I came into money and I'm sitting in the hospital wondering how long I'll have to live, right? And seeing my wife cry freaked me out, freaked me out because she's an ER physician. I didn't, I barely saw her cry when we lost our twin and she cried a lot.

But like, I mean, the way she cried when, when she saw me on, on that oxygen freaked me out, freaked me out. I'm like, man, why am I in this situation? Why did I not know better? And so, for me now, success means freedom, and money is no good if it doesn't buy me the freedom to do what I want, where I want, with whom I want, when I want, in my prime, particularly.

Adam: Mm hmm.

Lloyed: And so, I said, you know, what are the places in the world where people choose to think about work and life differently, where I can spend more time with my kids? And now, if it takes away from my family, And my fitness, I'm pushing it late. And so, so being in this time zone also works because I wake up spending all day with my kids, I work out, go dancing with my wife, walk the beach, and now it's 9:30 here, so I'm doing podcasts and I've, I've spent the day doing things that bring my energy up.

Adam: Yeah, that's great. So you mentioned now a couple of times, losing a twin, tell me about that experience.

Lloyed: It was a very hard experience and more for my wife than anything else. We were trying to conceive for a long time after our first kid, naturally. And the second kid was IVF. Because it was just hard, it was just hard. Number of factors, right? Age catches up to you, the environment, free radicals, all of this, right?

But nonetheless, we went through like three IVF failures, and then that costs a lot of money. This is stuff I don't talk about, I've not talked about anywhere else except here. And then, I don't know what it was, but we, we went to this great facility in Denver, CCRM, which is one of the best in the world, and it so happened thatit ended up being twins. We went from having three IVF failures in California to now twins and we were super excited.

We bought like twin strollers. We had a baby shower for twins. We bought matching outfits. Think about the emotional investment. We took pictures with everything twin with my older daughter saying, you know, I'm twice as lucky and all these things, right? It becomes then more of an emotional connection.

And then I'm at a meeting in San Francisco and I get a call from Vivi crying and I freak out and I'm like, what happened? Like they can't track the heartbeat and I go there and she's surrounded by doctors and one kid has passed. Right. And this is now fifth month in, I think. And I just can't make sense of it.

I'm mentally shut because I'm not a medical professional. I don't know the ramifications. And all her doctor friends are surrounded. And, and we can't, we can't pull, pull the kid that passed anyway, Eliza. And so, a couple of days passed by now. She's sitting under watch sleeping under watch and then the doctors tell me that, hey, we're gonna have to pull out the second kid because the heartbeat is fluctuating up and down and up and down and I freak out.

I'm like, we've had now three IVF failures were this far. Like, are you really going to pull a kid four and a half, five months premature? Like, what are the odds? And Vivi just looks at me and she's like, I don't have time for you to play satellite doc. Like, These are my friends. This is our profession.

We're gonna go in. We're gonna take the risk. I took risk in everything business. She's on the other side of risk on in personal life. And so what happened was the umbilical cord wrapped around and choked the other kid and it was doing the same for Amelia. And so Amelia was born five month premature has a very tough time man Like she was in the incubator and we were looking at and seeing babies around us past right imagine she was born at a pound. Some seven, eight inches, less than a pound, like 500 grams and change or less and, uh, and like nine, 10 inches or really small. And it's like we observed her, looked like a little rodent and grew into a child with no signs of anything. Perfect. Like our miracle child. But, you know, I think what kept us sane during that time was there's this physician's mom's group and they had a group for parents with premature babies and so my wife would always log on and communicate with the people there and just seeing other people whose preemie kids had grown into full fledged functioning humans with no side effects or disabilities was encouraging, right?

And I think ultimately you gotta just manifest sometimes, right? And I think my wife, Vivi, she's willed this life into existence. It was a very tough time emotionally, mentally, and more for her. And until today, it's hard, right? Because every year, it's a hard time at the birthday.

And it's now five years.

Adam: Yeah.

Lloyed: We have her ashes in a heart next to my wife's dad's ashes, and it's something that you can't forget, especially for a mom. Like we saw this child in our hands that we had to cremate, right? And I think emotionally it's something there are some things in life that don't leave you.

And this is one of those things because you look at Amelia, they were meant to be identical, mono mono identical twins. That means pretty much one feels the other's pain, like that movie from, Jackie Chan or whatever it was. And so when we look at her, we think of the other one, right?

It's, it's not something that you can forget, but neither should you, right? I think life is meant to be full of good memories and not so good memories, not so happy memories, then not so happy ones help you realize that, you know, for every rose, there's a dozen thorns and that keeps you that keeps you sane or in check kind of thing.

Adam: Thank you for sharing that story with me. As your kids have started to kind of grow up as you've grown up. What would you say some of the more surprising things that you've discovered as a dad?

Lloyed: Oh, man. You know, I'll, I'll share some funnies. Actually, let me ask you this, what is the most common thing you hear from, from people?

Adam: One of the things that sticks with me is people sharing how perceptive kids are and how much they kind of absorb from you. And I think we all know that in theory, but I've had a lot of stories about kids sort of observing things that their parents are doing and kind of modeling that behavior.

And that's been really, a lot of people mentioned that.

Lloyed: So I'm glad you brought that up, right? So my wife, Vivi has been the mother and father figure for our kids, especially the girls. Because think about it. I wasn't really around just running for the business, building the community. And I didn't realize how much of an impact she's had on them until now we're relaxed.

I mean, we're living the best life and summer that just passed. Vivi had to go and spend the whole summer back in the bay. It's hot in Dubai. Anyway, she was teaching all summer to catch up on some shifts. The kids school ended in the end June. So I was to bring three kids. To San Francisco myself, so nine year old, five year old, and barely two.

Adam: On a cross world flight from Dubai.

Lloyed: 15 hours, couldn't sort the visa for the nanny, so no nanny, solo.

Adam: Oh no.

Lloyed: I kid you not, it might be the most memorable flight I have ever taken in my life. My nine year old went into Vivi mode she turned into like the reincarnation of my wife and she, as soon as we got to the airport, she changed my two year old's diapers.

She managed him the whole flight and didn't sleep with me. And we were just playing fun games and joking with each other while she put him to sleep and then she barely napped and she's like, you just hang out with Amelia and I'll take care of Zane, man, it was such a memorable flight and I get off and I, when I, when I go, she's like, you look energized more than anything like this. This kid is, is, is something and I guess, you know, I shouldn't have expected anything less because when she was seven and a half, she says, dad, why don't you go work for somebody who thinks like you so I can have my dad back. And now she says, you know, we like Dubai daddy.

We don't like California daddy because Dubai daddy is always around. And so, so I think you know, she, my wife has manifested herself into the kids and they're all extremely wonderful. But my nine year old is literally like having a partner in crime. It's like, it's, she's an adult. It's like having adult, we have adult conversations.

She does a lot. She plays music. She's into singing. She's into art. She's good in school and she just self manages, takes care of stuff. And I, dream kid so I'm I'm lucky and fortunate and I think a lot of this is nurture. It's not nature like 90 percent of what you are is nurture and that that's a key, key, key, key learning for me and so she's had good nurture and I had nothing to do with it.

Unfortunately.

Adam: So with your three kids, do you have a rebellious kid like you? Clearly your oldest daughter sounds like, a lot like your wife. Very driven and sort of absorbed a lot, but who's the rebellious kid in your family?

Lloyed: The second one, Amelia rebellious and obviously right. She had to fight for her life and will herself into existence when, you know, she's born like what? Four and a half, five months early, sitting in the incubator when kids around were dying. There's a picture that is so memorable for me. I think when she came off the hospital and done and dusted, the first time, I think within a week or four or five days, they want the mother to have, like, skin to skin with the premature baby, so to feel that warmth.

And I think it's the first time my wife held her on the chest. There's a picture of her. You don't see the face. I mean, you can't, like, it's horrifying, right? It's barely formed. There's a picture of her with her finger like this. Like, it was literally shaped like this. And I don't know if I can find the picture, which basically symbolizes that everything's gonna be okay.

She's the rebellious one in everything and you know, because she went through that. We just give in. We just give in. See, I often joke, me and my wife, after sort of 15/14 years of being married now feels like we're dating again because we're working US time zones I have a very light work because I just do my podcast and I'm on three boards I'm not in the day to day of the company she teaches and then every three months she goes back to the Bay Area for two weeks a shift so all our day is spent together right.

And this is, this is hilarious and you'll laugh, right? Because I think, I think one of the questions you had was the most frustrating thing that has ever happened to you as a dad. And it's always caused by my five year old is like, like, you know, me and my wife literally are like, we're dating again. You know, we went from teenagers and prom dates to then med school and startup and, and sort of residency and into this chaos.

So it's like, we're dating again. And fortunately we can do that in our you know 40s, early 40s. And so like every time we're getting intimate, she, like finds a way to barrel through the door. And I'm like, ah, man, like.

Adam: She's a heat seeking missile

Lloyed: It's a heat seeking missile. And then like, it's like, and then my wife feels bad and she has to accommodate and she's like, and, and she's like, you know what, if this is the only problem we have, be happy.

Adam: Yeah, that's, that's so funny. I love to ask people about parenting frameworks or guardrails that they have. I think you mentioned in our prep for this episode that you're a big fan of the positive discipline approach to parenting. So just tell me about how you bring that to parenting and what that means for you.

Lloyed: You know, I think a lot of times we praise the results, almost everyone, right? I think growing up, especially folks from like the Indian subcontinent, Asian from Asia, right? Like you praise the results. And if the results are not there, then you reprimand based on results. And I think my wife had it a lot harder than I did because it was pretty much like, you're gonna be doctors, if not, we're not paying for school kind of thing.

My parents were a little more easygoing. Because my mom stayed at home and my mom's super emotional like me. So everything's like, ah, my fingers hurt. I don't want to go to guitar class. Fine. Oh, somebody punched me. I don't want to do karate anymore. Oh, that's fine. Right? Like she was, she was very pampering.

And I think I needed tough love in life, which I got later in life for me to realize that life is not roses.

I think though, you got to reward the effort, not the results. I don't know, there's this great book called The Score Takes Care of Itself. And what that means is if you follow a process, and you keep following the process, eventually the score takes care of itself, provided it's the right process.

And so we do positive affirmations and reward the process, the effort, the effort involved. Versus saying, oh, this is so great, or this sucks and you could have done better. This is great. You're trying, and that's what matters. The other thing what I realized, and it's probably my family heritage, or mine and my wife's family heritage coming from Indian parents or, you know, Indian background.

It's all about education. I used to be able to climb walls when I was a kid, and a number of crazy things, but every time I was told, focus on studying, focus on your math and your English and all of this, and don't bother about all of this. We don't want you to get hurt. You're going to get injured. And I think to myself now, my second child, like Amelia, is everything I am.

She's huge into gymnastics and climbing and all of these things. And I would have probably pursued acting or music or the arts, right? That was my, my side, creative side. But I never had that encouragement because think about it. My parents were poor. They were trying to put food on the table and make sure we're educated.

So they were worried that we go down this path and, you know, we're going to end up broke. Right. And now that we have stability, my goal is to make sure our kids have great experiences, whatever they do, doesn't matter. They're an engineer or a doctor as long as they create and have great experiences and are happy.

They'll find fulfillment. And so, one is that positive affirmation on the effort, like rewarding the effort, more importantly, and encouraging things that bring them joy. Because a lot of what we chase in life, especially in the Western world, actually the whole world, is society's definition of success.

What always comes from the negotiable. I can't work in the city, but I need to take this job in the city, so I'm gonna live in the burbs and commute. Even if it damages my quality of life, or you know what? I can't eat healthy. I can't work out. So I'm just going to eat this crap. Everything starts with a negotiable, and I want my kids to experience non-negotiables.

What are your values? And don't back down from that. For any amount of money, because ultimately money is no good if it doesn't buy you the things that bring you joy. And the things meaning the experiences, or the way of life, the freedom, kind of thing. And so we encourage, right now they're in like, gymnastics and art and drama and music and dance and rollerblading, whatever it is, they do more extra activities and that fills up their life and time than school.

And I, I truly feel what you do creatively outside of work. Outside of your nine to five is what makes you as a human. Because think about it. Everyone is doing one thing, going to school or doing a nine to five. How many people step out of the nine to five to make time to consistently do something else to expand their creative side?

What you are in business and in life is how you expand your brains outside of the nine to five.

Adam: Yeah. Yeah. No, that's really good advice. a lot of parents would benefit from following that, I think.

Lloyed: It's worked for us. Honestly, I didn't know better. It's not my style, but you know, of course I have a rock star of a partner And it's like reward the effort and and she's like, I was never rewarded for the effort.

I was always told to excel in academics. Like, I wanted to do all these things. And I'm like, yeah, I wanted to dance. I wanted to learn gymnastics. I'm 43. I can do the human flag right now. Why? Because as soon as I came into freedom,

I started learning the things that I never could have access to as a kid.

We're taking bachata. We're taking dance. We're working out. I wanted to do the human flag. So I practiced that. I want to do the splits. I'm learning all of this now. I wanted to do them as a teenager

Adam: Yeah.

Lloyed: But I never had the opportunity. And so I'm like, why rob the kids? You're right. Why rob the kids of that?

I'll let them do everything while they can and while they can grasp.

Adam: Yeah. You, you've talked a lot about your wife and her being the rock of the family and the partnership that the two of you have and, you know, being kind of almost like you're in high school again. Now, I want to talk about the other side of this for a second, because I always think this is funny. What is something that you and your wife don't agree on when it comes to parenting

Lloyed: School. I'm an anti schooler. I'm an I'm an anti schooler. I didn't finish high school. Like I said, I feel like if I didn't go to university, I would have expedited my path to becoming an entrepreneur. You never know, because again, there's two sides to this. And now I think we see eye to eye and she made me realize this.

She's like, you talk a lot about community and you are everything you are because of community. And truly I am the people I know in Dubai or anywhere around the world to the growth equity firm that bought half of Boast and liquidated us. I know all of these people through my community, through the traction community, literally came to some event I hosted and came into the fold. And so she tells me, how did you meet your co-founder? Because without Alex, there would be no Boast. There would be no company. This journey wouldn't be possible. I'm like, I met him in university. We're partners in every project. So she's like, that's what I'm trying to tell you.

Kids can interact with adults only, right? And if you put them, if you homeschool them, then they're only forced to interact with adults. They crave attention from other kids. And you may not care for the academics. You may feel like it's ancient, it doesn't change. I agree. But put them in there for the community and the social connection and the extracurricular.

And so we never saw eye to eye for a very long time on this. But when she broke that down to me in sort of what's important to me, which is community and social connection, it started to make sense. Uh, but, yeah, for the longest time, we didn't see eye to eye and and her thing is, I mean, she's doing well.

She got into med school second year undergrad. I didn't finish high school. I've done okay. But in reality, you know, although I have this opinion that you don't need to go to school to be successful, the reality is if she didn't pay the bills for the last 10 years, I wouldn't be here either.

Adam: Yeah.

Lloyed: Right? A lot of people talk about family privilege, right?

I may not come from family privilege, but I have a wife who's a freaking doctor at Stanford who persevered through three failed startups and paid the bills.

Adam: Yeah.

Lloyed: So I had privilege at home in my own way

Adam: Yeah. That's a good acknowledgement. Couple more questions for you and then I want to get to my famous rapid fire round. What is something that you feel like you've had to give up to become a father?

Lloyed: Man honestly, nothing. Initially I always was afraid of having kids because I viewed everything as a cost. And especially when you don't have money, it's hard. But as I always believe in business, pain is the precondition for growth. I think Vivi made me see that in personal life. It's the same.

It's no different. And so really I haven't, I don't think I've had to give up anything to have kids or I, I never saw it that way. I mean, we had kids. I still did the business and, you know, I'll tell you guys this, outside of work, you spend all your time with your partner. Make sure you choose your companions wisely.

Your well being depends on it. Right? She made sure that we had a nanny even when we couldn't afford it. So I didn't have to give up on my business goals. That's the reality. Now you want a hack? If you can pick one or two things. Two, three vacations a year, maybe a fancy car, et cetera, et cetera, or a nanny and just take stock of your life.

How often are we fighting about doing stupid chores? If that's a more than two times a week, then you better believe having a nanny is going to improve your quality of life over that two week vacation or that fancy car. Because what good is the fancy car? If every time you and your partner are in it, you guys are arguing,

Adam: Right. Right.

Lloyed: Right? What good is, what good is that vacation where every time you're there, you're, oh, you're on the laptop. Oh, you're not taking care of the kids or you're like, what good is it? What good is it? It's good for Instagram, but not good for your mental health.

Adam: Yeah. What is a mistake that you've made as a father?

Lloyed: Oh, you know, a lot of mistakes, man. I think like, it's not something you come experienced with, but I think. I regret the two or three moments where in a fit of anger, I've yelled at my kids because they don't know and yelling at them doesn't make it better. In fact, they don't understand it and that's more an emotional response from your side, but they don't get it and it makes no difference.

I was never yelled at by my dad growing up. And I wish I could emulate his behavior but sometimes you get impatient and you're in an environment where like, you know, it's COVID times and like you're on a Zoom call with lots of people and somebody yanks the internet connection and you lose it, right?

But I regret that. The other thing I regret, and this is the biggest regret and hopefully, fortunately, my kids are not going to be old enough to remember. But I was on the phone and in my office all the time. I barely spent any time with them. It was the biggest mistake I ever did. Like I missed, you know, I missed it with my older one.

And then when Amelia was born premature, I promised myself I wouldn't do it. And I was really good. And then one summer when we went into due diligence, I started neglecting her. And literally in a matter of a month and a half, I saw the switch from daddy to mommy. In a big way.

Adam: Hmm. Mm

Lloyed: Right? And, and so I think that'll be a regret, but like, I think the key thing is to have an open and honest conversation with your partner about what you guys are doing right and what's not so you can improve, right?

It’s really funny. We're proactive on everything other than our own wealth. Our own health and our own relationships. Have you noticed that? Like when it comes to work, we want to be the first to show up and the last to leave and be proactive with ideas to impress this boss who's not going to matter in a few years.

But what about your personal relationship and your personal health and your personal wealth? Like why aren't we proactive? And I think finding the time to connect with your partner is huge. If you want to go fast, you go alone. If you want to go far, you go with a team. This is everything, right?

You got to make the time to have that conversation. And what I like is if you can have a no BS conversation about the good, bad and the ugly, it's really good, right? I'm, I'm just trying to catch up on 10, 11 years of being an absent dad. I mean, nine years of being an absent dad and 11 years of being a mostly absent husband.

Right. And so, after my third kid, my wife put on a lot of weight. I mean, she's managing the house, has a crazy schedule and also the kids and everything else. So she put on a lot of weight and Of course, for my mental health and well being, we moved to this beach environment where everything is taken care of.

You know, it wasn't her preference, but she did it. And of course, now she loves it because it's like being in Dubai is like flying business class for, for cheap. And when you have to go back and do chores yourself, you realize the value of it. But nonetheless, I was able to transform through that journey because she made it possible.

She could have said, no, freaking hell, no, I'm leaving. She grew up in New Jersey. Right, like she moved to New Jersey when she was, I think, 11 or 12. So now at like 38 to move here, Is, but she did it. And so I had this massive transformation and six pack and everything. And then I said, you know what, what can I do for her?

That'll enable me to maximize my time with her and make her happy. So now, earlier this week, uh, we started a 150 day 40th birthday transformation challenge. She turns 40 next April. So I said, I'm going to eat like you, I'm going to train with you, cardio with you, dance with you. We're going to do this, walk the beach together.

And so I'm journaling that on my Instagram every single day. So we're on, we're on, I think it's day five of 150. And I think she'll be happy because I, you know, I don't want to be, every time somebody compliments me that, oh, you've lost a lot of weight, you look great. I think to myself, who made it possible?

Yes, I had the opportunity to go and train and do all this stuff, but who made it possible? We're here. Because of her. And so I'm like, you know what? I wanna do the same. So you can get the compliments too.

Adam: That's great. I'm sure really appreciates that.

Lloyed: Despite us having somebody who cooks and everything, I'm literally cooking three meals for her and taking pictures of it, I'm getting joy out of it. I don't do things that I'm not passionate about. That's the, that's the thing. And so after Boast and, and doing Traction, then I put all my energy into making the book a bestseller.

I have no project. I have nothing for the next five months. Let's do this. Let us do this.

Adam: Yeah. So last question , how can people be helpful to you on your journey? If, if folks are listening to this and they're like, Oh, I want to follow along with Lloyed and his life.

Lloyed: You know, I was posting a lot on LinkedIn in the last six weeks, seven weeks. What I did was to make the book a bestseller. I recorded 80 podcast in nine week period.

Adam: It's a lot of podcasts. 

Lloyed: And they all released the week of my launch. And then I think I got burnt out.

And I said, I need a break. Like, I've literally now I expedited the launch and I. I said I wouldn't do this, but I literally disappeared on my family. Fortunately, like they were in the States. I came back early to do this. And so I just disconnected from LinkedIn and I'm spending some time on Instagram because I think it's more personal and it gets me to chronicle and do things on the personal side.

But I don't know, man. Like, I only say this. If you learn anything from me, maybe even one takeaway. Just. Pay it forward. I think the only way to have everything you want in life is to help others without expecting anything in return. And this is not something that, you know, I'm just saying, but it's part of our DNA in a sense.

Like I said, my mom grew up in the slums of Mumbai and she had nine siblings. And every summer when I visit there, there's some stranger or the other in that slum there. And. Because Mumbai is the New York City of India. That's the reality. You want jobs from the villages, you come in there. And there's been some stranger or the other, and I asked my grandparents, like, why do you have this person here?

You barely have room for us. And they tell me the only way to create abundance in life is to help others without expecting anything in return. Those people might not help you, or see you. But you'll get everything. And today, none of his kids are in the slums, none of his grandkids are in the slums.

Everyone's well off in some capacity or the other different parts of the world. And I truly believe we've inherited the karma that my grandparents generated living in that slum. So, if I could leave you with anything, I'm living my best life. But I think if you learned one or two things, just spend the time with your family.

Spend the time helping others. and you'll see the difference. Compound interest and just being there for your community, your people is huge.

Adam:Pay it forward. I love that lesson. All right. Now, are you ready for our rapid fire round?

Lloyed: Let's do it, man. I don't know. We talked about a lot of things that this is going to be hard. Okay, let's, let's go for it.

Adam: Yeah. So the rules of rapid fire are simple. I ask you a question as quickly as you can, you give me a response and then we move on. So here goes. What is the most indispensable parenting product that you have ever purchased? 

Lloyed: This is going to be funny, melatonin gummies

Adam: Love that. Everybody's used some of those at some point, I think. Okay. What is the most useless parenting product that you've ever purchased?

Lloyed: These expensive ass $500, $600 strollers we bought, our kids never wanted to sit in any one of them. They're just useless.

Adam: Did you ever drop one of your kids as a baby?

Lloyed: Yeah, my oldest one and my wife's like, watch, watch, watch. And then in no time, we have this very high bed and, and she landed on her fours. I freaked out. I think, you know, I think I cried freaking out so…

Adam: All right, but your daughter seems to be doing just fine, so

Lloyed: She's just, she's just fine.

Adam: All right. How many dad jokes do you tell on average each day?

Lloyed: Bro, I tell a lot of dad jokes. I'm, I'm notorious for making stupid jokes and trolling everyone. My kids don't believe a word I say. My cousins, my parents, nobody believes anything I say because I'm trolling. And you know, what's really funny is I'm going to tell you this one dad joke because I'm in Dubai right now, Middle East.

And if this is Abdullah, what is this? 

Adam: I don't know.

Lloyed: Sheikh Abdullah. Sheikh means Sheikh,

Adam: Yes.

Lloyed: They don't say Sheikh. Actually, it's pronounced Sheikh in the Middle East. So if this is Abdullah, this is Sheikh Abdullah.

Adam: Sheikh Abdullah. I love that, that’s a Dubai dad joke. This may be the first ever of those on the pod, so.

Lloyed: You know, nobody in Dubai knows it. Every time I tell people, they just laugh. I don't know where I found it, but nonetheless,

Adam: Have you ever pretended to be asleep to avoid being woken up in the middle of the night by one of your kids?

Lloyed: All the time, all the freaking time, like more yes than no. And you know what? There's, there's some science to this. Yeah. If you, if you go and look after them, then the cries get stronger and stronger and stronger. If you let it pass, they just stop. And I've observed this with my oldest and with my youngest.

No rules for the middle one. I don't know what it is with my wife and I, like, middle one has, has hall pass and everything.

Adam: So I know you're in Dubai, but when is it acceptable to start blasting Christmas music?

Lloyed: Man, Dubai is like probably the most liberal Middle Eastern place. Like if you want to learn anything about Dubai, just go to Instagram and search five palm F I V E palm.

It's like all the influencers moved here. It's like, you know, bikini clad women at parties and beaches and, and then.

This is everything, basically, right? But, honestly, for my family, like, they're blasting Christmas music year round, man. Like, year round. It's, it's a thing. And my dad's a retired executive chef. And he was a very celebrated executive chef. And he worked in the Middle East, in Kuwait, and Oman, and Dubai.

And in ‘99, moved to Canada. And so my kids love having them around. My parents, when they come, they spend three, four months of the year with us, and they take over the kitchen. And so they're making now, from next week, they're going to start, like, it's a process, making Christmas sweets. And it's a combination because we're Indian Catholic.

So it's a combination. It's like Indian flavors. And the Catholicism, for the most, where my family is from, has brought influences from Portugal. So they mix up like Indian with Portuguese with West. It's like, it's insanity.

Adam: That sounds pretty fun. What is the most difficult kids TV show that you've ever had to sit through?

Lloyed: Man. That's like this Cocomelon with my two year old. And I think I've had this experience with every one of them. And it's like on repeat and repeat is the same thing over and over. It's usually music with them. I don't know. I think all my kids are musically inclined and there was this, there was this Indian movie that recently won the Oscars for the best original music. It's called RRR. And there's this song where they're jumping and dancing. And, and my five year old and two year old just want to play that on repeat. And it's like heavy drums and kicking. It's like every time we're in the car, it's nonstop. So yes,

Adam: It's funny that you mentioned Cocomelon because I think that is like, 80% of the people who have answered this question have said cocomelon,

Lloyed: They're doing something right.

Adam: Have you ever used your kids as an excuse to get out of social events?

Lloyed: Yes. Once a week or twice a week.

Adam: I love that

Lloyed: It used to be never and now I've expedited it.

Adam: Yeah. How good are you at assembling toys and furniture for kids?

Lloyed: I'm horrible at it. I, every time I've tried to do it, there's like anxiety and tears. And so, you know, we discovered Task Rabbit many years ago. And my wife's like, it's my best friend.

Adam: Awesome. When was the last time on that note that you fixed something and it actually worked?

Lloyed: Actually I fixed something today. The power switch had tripped and the lights were off and I just pushed it back to position and the lights came on.

Adam: And you could, you can, that's it for the year. You're good. End on a high note. 

Lloyed: Honestly. I have like anxiety with these things, with these things and filling forms and the forms thing, you know, of course, our company Boast automates government inefficiencies, but anything that has like, ah, this is going to be a laborious process gives me anxiety. So I don't do it.

I hire people to do it. I'm like, my life is better. It's fine. If I lose some money. Yeah.

Adam: What is the most absurd thing that you've ever done to make one of your kids stop crying?

Lloyed: I can do a phenomenal fake cry. And I cry. I've cried to a point where they think something happened to me and then they stop crying. This has happened a couple of times

And then the attention has shifted from them from me to them in front of them to me and they're trying to console me. Oh, I love it.

I'm like that. Have you watched this? The series my wife and kids?

Adam: I have not.

Lloyed: With, My wife and kids. I gotta, I gotta tell you who it is. It's a

Funny show.

Adam: We'll put it in the show notes for sure.

Lloyed: Yeah, I'm, I'm that dad. My wife and kids. Damon Wayans in there. It's hilarious, and we didn't have kids when I used to watch that show, but you know, my wife would always tell me, you are literally this guy, you're like trolling your kids, you're doing all this craziness, like you're going to be, you're going to be that dad.

We weren't married. It's a 2001 show. We got married in 2009. I truly ended up being that. I'm always trolling, always joking around. That's, that's, that's me.

Adam: Awesome. How often do you tell your kids back in my day stories?

Lloyed: All the time. Back in my day we used to walk 10 kilometers and we had no internet. I basically I tell the stories that my Dad used to tell me because I had never experienced. I didn't have to walk barefoot or walk the mountains I just make it up and I just tell them like once a week and they're like they think now my parents are here.

So they just asked them and they're like, what are you talking about?

Adam: Yeah, your parents destroy the illusion for you, unfortunately.

Lloyed: My kids don't believe anything they know I'm always trolling them now. Yea.

Adam: How many times have you said go ask your mother this week?

Lloyed: I mean they know the rules, mom's the boss at home like, I do not interfere especially like when it comes to like snacking or like any anything that they're trying to get out on from me like listen Mom's the boss. She makes the rules. I follow the rules. That's it. Don't ask me.

Adam: Okay. Last question for you. Last rapid fire. With three kids. What is your policy or your stance on minivans?

Lloyed: Oh, I have a minivan. It's I have a Tesla Model X It's a minivan and it's a cool looking minivan like people for people who think the Tesla Model X is not a minivan. It is a minivan. What they did was they found the right demographic and they just made the doors open like this again It's automatic doors that open like this not like this. Everything else about it is like a minivan.

It's got stuff for kids to play in. It's got great legroom. It's got front and back space. I'm not into cars, so like, it works. I probably wouldn't drive a regular minivan, so like, thank you Elon Musk for making this, this car with doors that open like this. A minivan with doors that open like this. But yeah, I think, here's the thing, man.

When you have a big family, like three kids, you need space, right? Because car seats and all of this stuff take a lot of space, and then you are always dumping stuff in the car. A lot of what you need is to operate for comfort and not for style. And so get the biggest damn car you can afford. Right. The cars are not an asset.

They are liabilities. So understand that and buy the biggest damn thing that is reasonably or cheaply for that price that will last you a long time and make peace with it.

Adam: Yeah.

Lloyed: That's it. That's your reality

Adam: That's the parting advice. I love that stance on cars. Okay. With that Lloyed, it has been a pleasure having you on the program. Thank you very much for taking the time and thank you for sharing so candidly with me.

Lloyed: This was a lot of fun and I think a lot of people will enjoy because it's a huge departure from all my other interviews.

Adam: Thank you for listening to today's conversation with founder, entrepreneur and author Lloeyd Lobo. If you enjoyed the show, please subscribe, share, and leave me a review. It'll help other people find this podcast. Startup Dad is a Fishman AF production with editing support from Tommy Heron. You can stay up to date on all my thoughts on growth, product, and occasionally parenting by subscribing to the Fishman AF newsletter at www.fishmanafnewsletter.com. Thanks for listening. See you next week.